<div dir="ltr">I proposed a fix on this bug: <a href="https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1929587" target="_blank">https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1929587</a> to disable the place hold button in the staff catalog if there are no holdable copies.<div><br></div><div>Looking again at how the traditional staff catalog handled it, it looks like I didn't notice a check for the user permission: PLACE_UNFILLABLE_HOLD: "Allows a user to place a hold that cannot currently be filled."</div><div><br></div><div>If the new fix includes the check for that permission, it seems like that would solve this problem. The place hold button will be disabled except for users with that permission.</div></div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, Jun 1, 2021 at 2:20 PM Deanna Frazee <<a href="mailto:DFrazee@killeentexas.gov">DFrazee@killeentexas.gov</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal">The downside of allowing staff to place holds in such situations is that they may place holds on things you would never consider replacing. For example, we would look for the most up-to-date exam prep books when one our SAT, GRE, etc.,
books go missing. We may or may not get one from the same publisher so we cannot count on a serial record saving the day.
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<p class="MsoNormal">What would be helpful would be for the ability for staff in certain permission groups to be able to place holds on lost items.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14pt;font-family:"Bahnschrift SemiBold Condensed",sans-serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Deanna Frazee<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Director of Library Services</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:"Matura MT Script Capitals";color:rgb(31,73,125)"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Killeen Public Library<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">City of Killeen, Texas<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">254-501-8995 (office)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">254-501-7704 (fax)<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="mailto:http://dfrazee@killeentexas.gov" target="_blank">dfrazee@killeentexas.gov</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="http://www.killeentexas.gov/" target="_blank">www.killeentexas.gov</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>From:</b> Evergreen-general <<a href="mailto:evergreen-general-bounces@list.evergreen-ils.org" target="_blank">evergreen-general-bounces@list.evergreen-ils.org</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Benjamin Kalish<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 01, 2021 1:02 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Evergreen Discussion Group <<a href="mailto:evergreen-general@list.evergreen-ils.org" target="_blank">evergreen-general@list.evergreen-ils.org</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [Evergreen-general] HIGH_LEVEL_HOLD_HAS_NO_COPIES issues<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I think it is useful for staff to be able to place holds on records where no copy is available. An additional circulating copy might be added at a later date, or a lost copy might be returned, and staff should have the ability to place
holds with these eventualities in mind. I do agree that being able to suppress the place holds button from patrons is useful in these cases, but if staff wants to knowingly place holds in these situations they should be allowed to do so.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Benjamin Kalish<br>
Forbes Library / 413-587-1012 / <a href="mailto:bkalish@forbeslibrary.org" target="_blank">
bkalish@forbeslibrary.org</a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.5pt">Support Forbes Library:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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</span></span></span><u></u>Consider <a href="https://forbeslibrary.org/giving/donate-online/" target="_blank">
<span style="font-size:9.5pt;color:rgb(17,85,204)">giving a gift</span></a><span style="font-size:9.5pt"> </span>to Forbes Library<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Currently reading:<i> The Rector of Justin</i> by Louis Auchincloss<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt">Just Finished:</span><i> All Systems Red</i> by Martha Wells<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt">For information about accessibility at the library, please see: <a href="http://forbeslibrary.org/accessibility/" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(17,85,204)">http://forbeslibrary.org/accessibility/<br>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, May 25, 2021 at 12:43 PM Elaine Hardy <<a href="mailto:ehardy@georgialibraries.org" target="_blank">ehardy@georgialibraries.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I was thinking of the public OPAC when I said we didn't have any reports of the place hold button being available and not the staff client.
<span class="gmail-m_-2323920511087023759gmaildefault"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">I realized that when I tried to place a hold and got the HIGH_LEVEL_HOLD_HAS_NO_COPIES error. This time it was for a bib record where all items are in a non holdable shelving location.</span></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">So revising my previous comment -- it would be good if the place hold button was not live in the staff client if no copies on the record were available for holds.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">I will check for a bug report.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(30,67,155)">J. Elaine Hardy</span></b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(30,67,155)">,<b>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 2:24 PM Elaine Hardy <<a href="mailto:ehardy@georgialibraries.org" target="_blank">ehardy@georgialibraries.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">To build on what Erica has said, when I have seen this in PINES, it has been when the copies attached to a title record are in holdable status but the library is set in the org unit settings
to be skipped in hold targeting.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif">I have not seen any reports since we have been on 3.6.1 of place holds being available when no items are attached to a bib record or if all items are in a nonholdable status/state.
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<b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(30,67,155)">J. Elaine Hardy</span></b><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(30,67,155)">,<b>
</b>PINES and Collaborative Projects Manager</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 1:23 PM Erica Rohlfs <<a href="mailto:erica.rohlfs@equinoxoli.org" target="_blank">erica.rohlfs@equinoxoli.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">I don't know if what I have to add will be helpful. I encountered this issue several years ago and tested on both the Web Client and XUL. The message is more specifically stating that "a hold
request at a higher level than copy has been attempted, but there are no copies that belong to the higher-level unit." Generically, Evergreen isn't letting you place a title hold if the only copies are effectively non-holdable. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 1:05 PM Terran McCanna <<a href="mailto:tmccanna@georgialibraries.org" target="_blank">tmccanna@georgialibraries.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I suspect that HIGH_LEVEL_HOLD_HAS_NO_COPIES is a generic error message that just means there aren't any copies that can fill the hold - either because there aren't any copies, or there aren't any copies that are in an available status,
or because the copies are age protected at other locations, or some other reason.
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I would recommend creating a new Launchpad bug report that 1) Requests that the Place Hold button is greyed out if a record has no holdings, and 2) Requests that a more human-readable error message is presented in place of that error message.
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<b><span style="font-family:Verdana,sans-serif;color:rgb(30,67,155)">Terran McCanna, PINES Program Manager</span></b><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Mon, May 24, 2021 at 12:54 PM Lindsay Stratton <<a href="mailto:lstratton@wlsmail.org" target="_blank">lstratton@wlsmail.org</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">I raised this at the conference Holds pre-session, and there were a variety of interesting responses, so I'll also raise it here.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">We recently upgraded to 3.6., and are noticing that when placing holds in the staff catalog, the Place Hold button is available for titles with no copies.The hold fails with the HIGH_LEVEL_HOLD_HAS_NO_COPIES error, with no override, etc.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">My issues:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">1) The place hold button had previously been "greyed out"/unavailable, which may have been a local template customization? but, it's misleading and frustrating<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">2) What is actually happening here? <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">3) Are there settings for this?<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">4) There are no permissions for the high level hold (<a href="https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1761241" target="_blank">https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1761241</a>)<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">5) the silent failure (<a href="https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1761238" target="_blank">https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1761238</a>)<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">FWIW, in my consortia, the holds are plain title holds, no OUs are set for hold skipping, we don't use parts.<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Lindsay Stratton</b><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b>Systems Librarian</b><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Westchester Library System<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">570 Taxter Rd., 4th Floor<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Elmsford, NY 10523<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="mailto:lstratton@wlsmail.org" target="_blank">lstratton@wlsmail.org</a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Erica Rohlfs</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Senior </span><span style="font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Implementation Project Manager</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Equinox Open Library Initiative</span><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif"><a href="https://equinoxOLI.org" target="_blank">https://equinoxOLI.org</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div>Dan Briem<br>Harrison Public Library</div><div>2 Bruce Ave. Harrison, NY 10528</div><div>(914) 835-0324<br><div><a href="https://www.harrisonpl.org" target="_blank">harrisonpl.org</a></div></div></div></div></div></div>