[OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client
Kathy Lussier
klussier at masslnc.org
Fri Mar 30 11:45:03 EDT 2018
> Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how we want it to work. (One
> of our libraries provided excellent screen shots.) Do I share that
> here or LP both?
I would put it on the Launchpad bug. However, whenever I add something
to LP that I believe needs broader end-user feedback, I usually post a
message to a list to let people know since they may not be following
that particular LP bug.
> Regarding IRC, I am not shy about my opinions on that. I have to use
> it for EOB meetings, but find it to be arcane to the uninitiated.
> Also, it is simply not the way people in libraries communicate.
Please note that the one tiny reference to IRC in an email was not a way
to push people to IRC who don't want to go there. It was just one of
many options I cited for discussing problematic bugs. People should use
the communication venue that works best for them. For many in the
community, librarian and developer alike (FWIW, I am a librarian),
that's IRC, but we're all on the list too and are listening to the
concerns and ideas raised here. My main concern, for tracking purposes,
is that any discussions happening here or in IRC about a particular bug
eventually get linked from the bug in the question. Otherwise, it's too
easy to lose the different threads of that discussion.
Kathy
On 03/30/2018 11:26 AM, scott.thomas at sparkpa.org wrote:
>
> Hi Kathy,
>
> Your points about “positive advocacy” are well-stated and well-taken,
> but advocacy is what we are doing with Congress as we try to get IMLS
> money restored for FY2019. We who live in the non-developer
> neighborhood of the Evergreen community have more power than that,
> and, yes, it does involve sponsoring development or bug-fixing projects.
>
> I also agree on the need for very good communication between those of
> us who want a feature, but are not developers, and those who have the
> skills to do the work. It is almost like I’m the patron and the
> developer is the reference librarian, and I am probably in need of a
> good reference interview. Regarding Holdings View, we can describe how
> we want it to work. (One of our libraries provided excellent screen
> shots.) Do I share that here or LP both? Regarding IRC, I am not shy
> about my opinions on that. I have to use it for EOB meetings, but find
> it to be arcane to the uninitiated. Also, it is simply not the way
> people in libraries communicate.
>
> I’ve been involved with Evergreen, us a user and then as a
> consortium leader, since 2015, and these recent discussion have been
> incredibly illuminating. I feel privileged to be a part of this community.
>
>
> Scott
>
> *From:*Open-ils-general
> [mailto:open-ils-general-bounces at list.georgialibraries.org] *On Behalf
> Of *Kathy Lussier
> *Sent:* Friday, March 30, 2018 10:46 AM
> *To:* open-ils-general at list.georgialibraries.org
> *Subject:* Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client
>
> Hi,
>
> In regards to this question:
>
> What can we do to get this fixed in 3.2 if not sooner?
>
> And the responses thus far:
>
> 1. Fix it yourself.
>
> 2. Hire someone else to fix it.
>
> 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> #4: work together to get it fixed (i.e. funding through development partnerships)
>
> I also would like to talk about the role of positive advocacy in
> getting attention on particular bugs, which may not guarantee that
> they get fixed, but certainly could draw enough developer attention
> towards the bug to result in it getting fixed. I guess this is really
> another spin on Jason's solution #3 - wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> What exactly is positive advocacy? It's raising discussion on the
> lists, just as we did here, to ask about a bug and to see if it also
> has an impact on other Evergreen sites. It involves participating in
> LP discussions or raising questions in IRC. It not only involves
> discussing why the bug is important, but contributing to discussions
> on the best approach to fix it. In the case of this particular bug,
> for example, there was discussion of adding a "show empty libraries"
> option and a question of whether it should replace the "show empty
> volumes" option or not. Getting feedback on questions like this is
> very helpful. If a developer decides to take on the bug, it will give
> them a clear direction for moving forward. Positive advocacy also
> includes committing to test a fix when it is available.
>
> On a related side note, that Sandbox request form we use for Bug
> Squashing Day is never turned off. If you ever want to test a bug fix
> when it's not Bug Squashing Day, feel free to submit it or contact me
> directly. If I have the a server and the time, I'm happy to load fixes
> so that people can help with getting that bug fix merged to Evergreen.
> It's available at https://goo.gl/forms/PE4fYfWDh5AixYpy2
>
> I use the word 'positive' because I do think there is a thin line
> between advocating that *we* as a community work together to fix a bug
> and treating the community as a *they *that should be fixing a given
> bug or introducing a new feature. FWIW, I am not saying that Scott was
> doing this when he raised his question. Given the amount of sponsored
> development that has come for both enhancements and bug fixes from
> PaILS, it's clear that he already recognizes his organization's role
> in contributing to the improvement of Evergreen. In general, though, I
> have seen this sentiment in other discussions, and, as frustrating as
> it can be when you're dealing with a problematic bug, we have to keep
> in mind that we're all on this together. The more people who take on
> the responsibility of helping improve Evergreen in some small or even
> large way, the better the software will be for all of our users.
>
> I'm guessing that part of the original question really related to how
> positive advocacy turns into an actual bug fix. With the release of
> 3.1, I think we're all seeing that 3.2, when the xul client will no
> longer be available for our users, is just around the corner. Although
> the web client has come a long way, I think it's natural that there is
> some anxiety over remaining bugs that are preventing staff from using
> the new client or making it difficult for them to use it.
>
> Based on my observations over the past eight years, I would say all of
> the following are factors in whether a bug gets fixed through these
> community channels.
>
> Does the bug break critical functionality? For example, you can't
> build the software, bib records can no longer be saved, you can no
> longer perform checkouts. Generally, these are the types of bugs that
> get High priority in Launchpad and are fixed very quickly.
>
> Is there a developer capable of fixing a bug who has the time to work
> on it or are they in the middle of some other large project, like a
> migration?
>
> How long will it take to fix the bug? Is it a complex or easy fix?
> https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1187993
> <https://bugs.launchpad.net/evergreen/+bug/1187993> has been a
> high-priority bug for five years now, but it's complex and will take
> many developer hours to fix. It's more difficult to get large fixes
> done without asking a developer in your own organization to fix it or
> funding the fix. Sometimes, low priority bugs get fixed simply
> because they're quick and easy and more people may be capable of
> fixing it.
>
> Does the developer believe it will also affect the people in their own
> organization? In organizations that have a developer, the positive
> advocacy may be the thing that brings it to the attention of some
> cataloger or circ person who then communicates to their developer that
> it is indeed a critical issue. If the problem is related to serials
> and the developer works at a library that doesn't use serials, they
> are less likely to work on it.
>
> Think of it in terms of volunteering that you may do in your own home
> communities. If somebody asks you to bake something for a bake sale to
> raise funds for a cause you believe in, you may quickly say yes
> without a thought. If they ask you to organize the bake sale, the
> answer may depend on whether you have time or on how strongly you feel
> about the cause. If you don't care about the cause at all (i.e. you
> can't understand why anyone would ever want Evergreen to work that
> way), you may never say yes no matter how much time you have. If the
> fundraiser is actually a capital campaign project for a new library,
> it doesn't matter how many people feel strongly about the issue, you
> may still need to hire a professional fundraiser to organize the
> campaign for you.
>
> No matter how much positive advocacy I personally do for specific
> bugs, in the end, I know if the MassLNC organizations feel strongly
> about a bug fix or feature, we need to be prepared to fund it or have
> one of our internal developers work on it. There are times when I've
> gritted my teeth while funding a project, either because I think the
> software should just work that way or because I feel like we've
> already invested enough into the feature. However, I also know we are
> also indebted to many developers in this community who have quickly
> fixed issues, both large and small, as a result of our positive
> advocacy. In the end, it all balances out.
>
> Kathy
>
> On 03/29/2018 02:02 PM, scott.thomas at sparkpa.org
> <mailto:scott.thomas at sparkpa.org> wrote:
>
> Jason,
>
> Thank you for this information. Regarding this particular bug, it is too serious to leave to #3, and we don't have the wherewithal to do #1 so we may try to do #2...but will likely need funding partners...which brings us to #4: work together to get it fixed.
>
> Scott
>
> -----Original Message-----
>
> From: Open-ils-general [mailto:open-ils-general-bounces at list.georgialibraries.org] On Behalf Of Jason Stephenson
>
> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2018 1:44 PM
>
> To:open-ils-general at list.georgialibraries.org
> <mailto:open-ils-general at list.georgialibraries.org>
>
> Subject: Re: [OPEN-ILS-GENERAL] Holdings View in Web Client
>
> On 03/29/2018 11:27 AM,scott.thomas at sparkpa.org <mailto:scott.thomas at sparkpa.org> wrote:
>
> I agree this is an impediment to implementing the Web Client in
>
> centralized or semi-centralized cataloging departments (of which we
>
> have many). I am just not conversant on the ins & outs of how to get
>
> fixes into a release versus a maintenance release versus a patch
>
> Bug targeting is done by one of the members of the drivers group. It is usually done only for bugs that have patches or where someone is working on it and is likely to have a patch ready in time for the release. We (mostly I) sometimes break the unwritten rules and target bugs prematurely.
>
> As for how to get specific bugs fixed, you basically have 3 options:
>
> 1. Fix it yourself.
>
> 2. Hire someone else to fix it.
>
> 3. Wait for someone else to do 1 or 2.
>
> HtH,
>
> Jason
>
>
>
> --
> Kathy Lussier
> Project Coordinator
> Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative
> (508) 343-0128
> klussier at masslnc.org <mailto:klussier at masslnc.org>
> Twitter:http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier
--
Kathy Lussier
Project Coordinator
Massachusetts Library Network Cooperative
(508) 343-0128
klussier at masslnc.org
Twitter: http://www.twitter.com/kmlussier
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